Talk:Joseph Joestar vs Gintoki Sakata/@comment-37767045-20190514005637/@comment-29436805-20200117004816

Well, Spoilers for the following serious arcs: the Shogun Assassination Plot Arc, The Farewell Shinsengumi Arc, and The Silver Soul Arc (In other words, skip my message unless you've caught up with the anime), Gintoki fought with Utsuro, who is about as "invincible" as Ultimate Kars. And he did win. In the Silver Soul arc, many cast members including the Shinsengumi, Kagura, Shinpachi, and Sadaharu all fought against him, knocking him into the Earth's altana, temporarily killing him. Utsuro seems to me to be of far greater strength than Kars, and while Gintoki did need help, there wasn't really any convenient "just blast this and you win" like Joseph had for Kars. In fact, while Joseph did need a decent amount of endurance to survive things like a plane crash and falling at terminal velocity into the ocean, his endurance seemed to still be within realistic human levels although very much near the higher end, as that's stuff that people have actually survived, but he didn't really defeat Kars with any sort of physical strength, whereas Gintoki had to fight very battered after constant battles with Amanto and then had to actually overpower Utsuro. Also remember the feats that Gintoki has with an average wooden sword, going so far as to cut clean through metal and consistently beating people with real weapons, as well as standing against Kamui, who was arguably the strongest Yato. Plus he's been blown up and stabbed in various places, only to get up and keep fighting. Generally speaking, his endurance and strength seems higher than Joseph's at any point, and he has used similarly underhanded plans (Such as Gintoki vs Kondou, where Gintoki tricked Kondou into fighting with a wooden sword which Gintoki had broken) to Joseph, and he's much more experienced (he's fought in a war and defeated many more powerful opponents than Joseph) than even Part 3 Joseph. It seems to me that Gintoki has Joseph outclassed in pretty much everything except ranged attacks... although you could argue that Joseph is much better at the underhanded plans.