Talk:Goku vs. Bowser/@comment-30607935-20170829011326/@comment-31550106-20170915191222

I'll admit that Bowser can be gullible and idiotic at times, but Mario has only beaten him alone with an ax or something and when he fought him physically it was with assistance with either items or others.

Not true. In the Super Mario Galaxy Games, it is possible to beat Bowser without any help or power ups.

By the way, I wouldn't call a plumber with power ups who can lift and kick castles away at small size and tank attacks from universal/above level characters weak.

True, but compared to Goku, he's pretty weak

Also, Dark Bowser, while being another version of Bowser as a result of Fawful and the Dark Star, isn't really completely similar to Bowser. Right before the fight, he can roar and the whole Mushroom Kingdom turns dark. Additionally, Dark Bowser is powered up by the Dark Star, so he can turn giant, trap Bowser in a cage, etc. After the Dark Star was destroyed, Dark Bowser weakens and then Bowser's last few punches make him explode and he loses the fight. Basically what I'm saying is that he isn't the same as Bowser completely.

True

Then again, Bowser can sizeshift by himself and while you are right about Bowser being slower as he grows bigger, his size (obviously), strength, and durability have increased by a LOT! But this has usually shown to happen when something falls on him/when he's mad.

Size and Strength are true, but not necesarilly durability. If anything, it would make him slightly less dureable because he has more surface area to be hit. Since Goku is still many times faster than Bowser when he's in regular size, being big would only make him a bigger target for Goku.

As for Goku surviving Hakai energy, which is damn impressive, notice how I said that Bowser was only a bit dazed after surviving all of that. Now imagine what would be needed to make him more than just dazed. A LOT! So, his full potential with durability hasn't really been seen and one more thing, this is Super Mario Galaxy Bowser we are talking about, meaning he's powerful, but not even close to his most powerful forms. Dreamy and Paper are far more powerful and Dreamy is capable of making wishes and all.

Hakai energy was capable of destroying multiverses, since it can destroy entire timelines. Bowser tanking a big bang + black hole + supernova is nothing compared to Hakai energy. Although Bowser does have Dreamy and Paper, which are thousands, if not millions of times more durable, you have to take into consideration that Goku was in base form when he tanked the Hakai, so his ssj and ssgss forms would be quadrillions of times more durable than that when he's not off guard.

Mario and Luigi are both superhuman, so combined, they were able to beat Dreamy, but still, it wasn't a stomp. It might be a pretty bad stomp if Paper Bowser is being used, especially if he gets access to the Chaos and Pure Hearts. Goku is definitely powerful, even without his God form, but Bowser can still manage to surpass his power.

Mario and Luigi are extremily inconsistant, so it would not make sense to scale them to Bowser. Although with both the Chaos and Pure Hearts combined, Bowser would be a lot stronger than DB Super Goku, 1. The Chaos and Pure Hearts are not in Bowser's natural arsenal and we've never seen Bowser use the Hearts, and 2. Xenoverse and DBZ Online are quintillions of times stronger than DB Super Goku. In a fight between Composite Bowser vs DB Super Goku, Bowser would win with the Hearts, but if you used Composite Goku, Goku would win mid difficulty.