Talk:Asriel Dreemurr vs Bill Cipher/@comment-28354863-20160711224429/@comment-26814804-20161205010326

The difference is, ASRIEL lost to a multiversal, unkillable, time-manipulating kid with more DETERMINATION than anything else in the universe. Bill lost to some normal kids and their drunk uncle. OK, maybe not normal. But CLOSER TO NORMAL THAN FRISK.

But yeah, Bill wins this one.

Also, Vegeta got absolutely torn to shreds by a kid. Nobody's saying that HE's weak. I'm sick and tired of the "[insert UT character] got killed by a kid!" argument. Not even just that. The "[insert character from fiction] lost to a [insert "weak" thing] so they must be weak" argument. It's bullshit.