User blog:Pikart767/I return to DBF to write a blog that rants about two big stuff in Mario VS.

HI I'M BACK AND IT'S 11 PM AFTER LISTENING TO FOUR TINY BUT VERY LOUD CHILDREN FOR 4 DAYS AND I'VE GOT A MASSIVE MIGRAINE SO TO RELIEVE STRESS I'MA WRITE A BLOG ABOUT MY OWN VIEWS ON MARIO AND IF YOU DISAGREE OR HAVE REASONS TO THEN FAIR ENOUGH MARIO'S ALREADY A HELLA VIEW BASED SERIES.

I'm starting this return with a bang cuz ima write two of the most things that confuse me about mario in vs.

Mario is Paper Mario???
So IDK if this is still a thing here but VS and some other sites say they're the same but;

Mario and Paper Mario are two seperate entities from different universes in the same overall world, and no amount of references can say otherwise when you've got A ENTIRE GAME that states that they're completely different.

like legit, most of the arguments for Mario and Paper Mario being the same can boil down to references, or just flat out having evidence or reasonings that disprove them or make them increadibly unlikely from being the same. I'll list afew that I can think from the top of my head. I think you can get the point. When you have a ENTIRE game that depicts the two being from different universes, against afew references that
 * Super Mario 64 DS/Mario Kart DS: Goomba King, the first boss in Paper Mario, seemingly exists in both these game, but the thing is, while both are very similar in design, the two versons hold different names (Paper Mario's is named the Goomba King, while in SM64DS and MKDS they are named Goomboss), and, even then, it isn't unreasonable to say the Goomba King has a non-paper version of itself in reality. This goes for alot of enemy references, but will just be a supporting point.
 * Mario Party 5: Even if I personally see using Mario Party in VS is bogus for reasons that will be later discussed, it is still a part of Non-Paper Mario. The Star Spirits, a very important part of Paper Mario, appear in this game as this game's hosts. However, Mario Party Top 100 in it's card lists these Star Spirits spawn from the Dream Depot, which is a radically different than Paper Mario's Star Haven, which, is where the Star Spirits in Paper Mario come from. This boosts the previous last point of there being variations of eachother in Mario. While the next two Mario Parties have some references, they aren't anything notable and fall under this argument.
 * Super Mario Sunshine: Rather than the last two, this stems back to the Thousand Year Door having the Shine Sprites and Pianta's (I believe?). Both can be chalked up to the latter arguments of there being both Paper and Main variants to eachother. As both aren't just exclusive to Super Mario Sunshine with the Pianta's being especially notable with having a load of smaller appearences as entities in the Mario universe. The Shine Sprites serve a different purpose in TTYD than in their initial appearence anyways, and there are no returning Pianta's from Sunshine or any later game, leaving little room for this point.
 * Mario and Luigi: Superstar Saga (DX): In both the original and DX, there exists a room with blocks referencing Mario's history, and one of the blocks shown in from Paper Mario. However, this room is supposed to be a literal reference and a small nod to Mario's entire history to that point. Paper Mario is a part of Mario's overall history, so leaving it out here would be a disservice.
 * Mario Kart: Notably in this case, Paper Mario: Color Splash has referenced Mario Kart various times. However, it's likely that the Paper Mario universe also has Kart Racing likewise the main universe, even outside of a reference standpoint. I meaaaaan they literally show Luigi having a kart that rides on a Rainbow Road, so this can be taken in this way, and as the two universes hold alot of parallels involving enemies and roles, this isn't unlikely. They do reference Luigi's Death Stare (which has become an actual thing in Mario Kart, staying even in the latest Mario Kart Tour), but that's hardly a reason to say that the two are the same. In Mario Kart GBA, the Flying Bowser Castle from Paper Mario appears. This is likely a reference more than anything, and stems from a spinoff series, so it alone would not support the two verses being the same.
 * Commercials: I don't see this being a mainstream argument, but I'm covering it anyways since I've seen it used. A select few commercials (apparently) depict Mario and Paper Mario being the same. However using commercials is a horrendous argument, and infact the branding for commercials tend to be written by the advertising comphanies that Nintendo hires, not Nintendo themselves. Even then, if said commercials are directed by the big N, you can depict alot of stuff that isn't canon or doesn't actually happen in commercials, it's just used to advertise the product they're trying to sell you.
 * SSBB's Trophies: Or more rather, trophy. Toadette has a trophy in SSBB that uses both Main and Paper series for her information. However, not only are Smash Trophies very much not canon to anything outside of itself, but these trophies tend not to be written by the same developers that work with Mario. As Smash is mainly developed by companies that, while very close, are still outside of Nintendo, it's hard to take any information from trophies for anything outside of Smash itself.
 * Luigi's Mansion: While Paper Mario foretells Luigi's Mansion happening with Luigi's fear of ghosts, this isn't sufficient evidence to say they are the same universe, as neither are referenced beyond that.

But to put even more into perspective?

If we followed the reasoning and say that Paper Mario and Mario are the same through such reasons above...

Link, despite obviously being from a different series entirely with it's own radically different stories, '''should exist in the Mario universe. '''

Yes, it's pretty obvious the two are from different universes today, and I am in no way saying that they are infact from the same universe, but, I'm saying this to look in perspective when you compare the reasonings I'll give for Link being canon in Mario, the the reasonings others give for Main Mario and Paper Mario being the same universe. I could continue listing evidence to why the two are the same, but I think you see my point...
 * Mario and Luigi: Superstar Saga (DX): An item in the game, the Great Force, is shown visually to be the Triforce, and is a reference to it.
 * Mario Kart 8: Link himself is playable in the game, and there's a entire track based on the series present in the game. Link even has his own course in the original Mario Golf, to boot.
 * Link's Awakening (Remake): Literally the whole game, in both the original and remake is filled to the brim with references to Mario enemies. Infact, this isn't just limited the Link's Awakening, if you want to say that it's just a dream. A Link to the Past, Four Swords Adventure, and Minish Cap all reference or just flat out have enemies from the Mario series.
 * Wario Land II and Super Mario Bros 3: In both games, there's items that match items from the Zelda series. Super Mario Bros 3's Recorder is directly from The Legend of Zelda, sharing the tune and have similar appearences, and various treasures from Wario Land II are from the Zelda series.
 * Donkey Kong Country 2, Super Mario RPG, Mario Maker 2, etc.: Link flat out appears in all these games, and more!

I'm drawing parallels to how almost every piece of evidence that's present for Mario and Paper Mario revolves around references and cameos, and how a character who is from a completely different series and universe would be canon in the series if we base it around that. That doesn't matter if we have official reasoning or showings as to why the two are different if all that's left outside of it is statements. Like how Link isn't canon to Mario through games and statements, we have a entire game that shows that Paper Mario and Mario aren't the same.

Until there's actual statements or showings (or if there's something drastic I don't know about, which there might be honestly, knowing how big Mario is) to Paper Mario and Mario's universes being the same, then, I see little reason as to why to believe the two are still the same.

'''TL;DR: References vs Official. Taking references too literally makes Link (and potentially The Legend of Zelda) canon to Mario, for all the same reasons and more for why you'd think Paper Mario and Mario take place in the same universe and more despite both having games and claims that prove the opposite.'''

There's one thing I didn't cover for the argument however...

What the Canon
...i'm writing this later i'm tired it's 1am and i've still got a raging migraine.