Talk:Classic Video Game Hero Battle Royale/@comment-30294856-20170907221635

Here's how I see it going for each round:

NOTE: Nearly all of the information about Mario came from a good friend of mine, Metal Mario875.

Round 1
6. Pac-Man - Well, Pac-Man is pretty much screwed here. Everyone else far outclasses him in stats. The highest he's reached on his own without any outside help is 8-B with his Skateboard. Everyone else is Tier 5 and above. Similarly, his speed is only Superhuman, whereas everyone else is at least FTL. Pac-Man has some decent hax, but it's not enough to keep up with everyone else here. Because of this, he should be the first to go.

5. Mega Man - Classic Mega Man's peak is Small Planet level for fighting par with Sunstar and Duo and Evil Energy, and the latter two could do this. His peak speed is Massively FTL from dodging attacks from Duo's Meteor Form and navigated Space Rush Across the asteroid belt, with Massively FTL+ teleportation speed for being the same speed as Proto Man's teleporter, which went from Earth to Pluto nearly instantly. That makes him faster than Bomberman, but the gap in Attack Potency is so massive (with Bomberman at his peak being Universe level+) that he would never even SCATHE Bomberman in the first place. He has some decent abilities such as Immunity to Soul Manipulation and Mind Manipulation and Transmutation, but they aren't enough to help him beat Bomberman.

4. Bomberman - Bomberman at his peak is Universe level+ from defeating The Angel Of Light And Shadow who created the Bomberman universe, and being able to survive its destruction and rebirth. His peak speed is FTL+ for being able to outrun black holes. He also has the ability to create black holes and stop time, Forcefield creation, Resistance to reality warping, and Space/Time Manipulation. Unfortunately, Mario, Kirby, and Super Sonic are so much faster that Bomberman wouldn't have a chance to land a hit on them. Even if he did, they are at least as powerful as Bomberman, if not more so. Not to mention that Mario and Kirby have dealt with black holes already, and that both of them as well as Sonic have either fought beings Time Manipulation or posses it themselves. Bomberman should put up a fight, but his speed and hax isn't enough to compete with the other three.

3. Sonic/Kirby - This one is tricky. Super Sonic is at least Universe level+ with likely Infinite speed from fighting the Time Eater. Kirby should be Universe level+ as well for defeating several enemies at this level. First off, Marx Soul, created a universe with countless stars, and said universe ceases to exist after his defeat. After Magolor's defeat, it seems as though the universe's fabric is tearing. Kirby also Dark Mind, who nearly conquered both the Mirror Dimension and Dream Land. The Mirror Dimension is a universe with an innumerate amount of stars, and Dark Mind not only corrupted it, but can manipulate its entirety. The difficult thing is that Kirby has a shit-ton of hax and copy-abilties while Sonic is infinitely faster in his Super form, with Kirby only being Massively FTL+. One of Kirby's best abilities is his Ghost Ability, which allows him to possess people. I don't thing Sonic has any immunity to this in his Super form. Though he resisted Dark Gaia's Mind Control in his Werehog form (unfortunately, his werehog form was permanently taken away by Dark Gaia), Possession is different from Mind Manipulation. He also has Time Stop via Beam Mage, which could help him counter Chaos Control. Unfortunately, Sonic already has Infinite speed for fighting a being that can erase space-time, so it might not work. The only problem I see for Sonic is that Kirby might be able to possess him or that his Super form may run out. Because of that, I'm not sure who wins between the two.

2. Kirby/Sonic - Despite the fact that M&L, SMG, Paper Mario, and Mario Party feats are being excluded, Mario actually has a few feats that put him on par with, if not superior, to both Kirby and Sonic. Mario has ways to counter both of their greatest assets. A lot of Mario's and Kirby's powerups have similar functions, so they counter each other. Additionally, Mario has resistantce to Elemental Manipulation, so a lot of Kirby's abilities could be practically useless. The only ones that might be a problem are Ghost Kirby and Kirby's Time Stop. The latter may not work, since Mario can harm intangible beings and even kill them (Boos), so he could knock Kirby out of his Ghost form before he could even be possessed. The reason Mario even can stand up to Sonic and Kirby in the first place is because of feats from two games.

In Super Mario Bros. 2, he is Universe level+ for defeating Wart, who conquered Muu once and Subcon twice. The latter is an entire universe, as it is a dream world. After his defeat in BS Super Mario Bros., Subcon, an entire universe, ceases to exist. Wart also put a curse over Subcon and its inhabitants, apparently altering the universe in some way. Conquering isn't the same as destroying it, but since the universe ceased to exist after his defeat, and that he altered the universe in a way, he should be at this level. His best feat, however, is is from Super Mario Sunshine, and puts him at Multi-Universe level. Shadow Mario polluted and cursed the entirety of Isle Delfino. He also has an amazing amount of knowledge on the Secret Levels, somehow knowing when Mario enters them and where they are all located. There are also cartoony designs within these universes [there being 10 of them in totality, possibly more, with four matching the standards and the others scaling] like the train tracks, which provides more evidence Shadow Mario created them. Not to mention the fact that his goop is flowing directly from a Secret Level here, proving his association with them. Because their celestial bodies match ours [Not to mention how those stars are different colors and luminosities, showing clearly that the Doppler Effect is in effect, making those levels expand infinitely—just like our universe. And this is without mentioning that another one of the Secret Levels has enormous clouds out in its space, which is identical to our universe's clouds in space that form galaxies over time. Clearly these are universes, and the infinite voids back it up] and because it's seemingly an infinite void, these are full-blown universes that Shadow Mario created. From scratch, mind you; meaning he also created their space-time continuums. We know he did so in a matter of seconds because there was a live commercial at the start of the game that shows everything hadn't been screwed up yet, and Shadow Mario was in the background, seemingly just arriving. And Mario was literally just about to arrive, meaning that Shadow Mario, somehow, corrupted the entire island and created these levels in a matter of seconds to minutes. Clearly he didn't take his time. Mario has the same physicality as Shadow Mario, thus, scales. What's more is that this puts Mario's speed at Infinite for (moving within the dimensional rift between each Secret Level. These aren't pre-destined rifts, either, as Shadow Mario left and never appeared in the Secret Level with Mario. With that said, this must have been a white, empty rift that Mario and Shadow Mario moved through on their own. The background moving was only because the two Marios were moving, evidenced by their blurs, so this was indeed an empty rift, and there are no speed feats that contradict Mario moving at that speed in that game. So, with Infinite speed and a Multi-Universal Attack Potency, Mario would be unaffected by Kirby's Time Stop or Sonic's Chaos Control, and far outclasses both of them.

1. Mario - Becausse of the above, I'm giving Round 1 to Mario.

Round 2
6. Pac-Man - See Round 1 for more info.

5. Mega Man - See Round 1 for more info.

4. Bomberman - See Round 1 for more info.

3. Kirby - Now that Mario and Sonic are composite, Kirby is completely outclassed, with both being far above their previous peaks. Due to the sheer gap in stats, Kirby doesn't have a chance in hell against Composite Mario or Archie Post-Genesis Sonic.

2. Sonic - This one actually ought to be close. Recently, I have placed both Paper Mario w/the Pure Hearts and Post-Genesis Archie Super Sonic at Low Hyperverse level with Immeasurable speed. I've gone over why I place Mario at Low Hyperversal many times, so I'll go over Sonic first. With the aid of Super Mega Man, Super Sonic stalemated God Sigma, who had transcended all limitations of the multiverse, which likely includes dimensional matrix, an 11-dimensional structure. This may seem like an assumption, but this is likely since we know Professor Von Schlemmer is reliable because he's been studying the Genesis Portals--old remnants of the Pre-Genesis multiverse--for his entire life; thus, he should know a thing or two about its physiology. Since God Sigma transcended it, he would be infinitely above that, or 12-D (Low Hyperverse level). I know I've gone on about my opinion on Mario being 11-D multiple times, but just in case, I'll do it again. Base Paper Mario should be High Complex Multiverse level (Defeated Dimentio, who matched The Void, which was going to consume all existence--all worlds, all dimensions, all possibilities and all timelines. And because String Theory Soup proves that the Marioverse's secrets reside within String Theory, which is a theory that supports 11-dimensionality, this feat was consuming eleven dimensions, making the characters 11-dimensional). Paper Mario with the Pure Hearts is Low Hyperverse level for killing Super Dimentio.

While some would argue that Super Paper Mario's highly controversial, "And in the end, it will consume all existence... All worlds, all dimensions." refers to the common synonym universe for dimension, there is plenty pointing otherwise. Dimension D is the piece of evidence to say they mean universe. What says it means space? Well, Merlon stating that The Void is a hole in the dimensional fabric of space, Bestovius being referred to as a dimensional governor that gives out the dimensional technique, said dimensional technique being one that flips the user between spatial dimensions, and, well, sense itself. Why? "And in the end, it will consume all existence... All universes, all universes..." < I'm sorry, but that just doesn't make sense. And besides, it consumes all existence and all dimensions, which would count as spatial as well due to the Marioverse abiding by String Theory.

This is a more in-depth explanation of why the Chaos Heart is Low 1-B. Tippi said: This sage was very wise and is even said to have written the Light Prognosticus... He was also a great magician who could control dimensions...

The statements that were emboldened will come in handy later.

Next...

The Light Prognosticus wrote: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A_IjEPiYXhE&feature=youtu.be&t=15m50s The Void will swallow all... Naught can stop it... unless the one protected by the dark power is destroyed. The hero with the power of eight Pure Hearts will rise to this task.]

Now, please recall that Merloo wrote the Light Prognosticus. And he is saying that not even he can stop this prophecy. Of course, he controls dimensions--so Super Dimentio clearly has to be beyond his reach of power--a twelfth dimensional being.

Believe it or not, this is actually backed up by something else. And that something else is backed up by how the manipulation of the concept of death works.

The manipulation of death, as a concept, open wide opportunities. With this, you can instantly both kill an object and on the contrary, make it immortal, depriving it of the concept of death. In addition, you can kill even conceptually immortal beings, if your concept is stronger than the concept of a target.

Now, I'm proposing that Queen Jaydes has power over the concepts of life and death, and I'll be matching what she's done to the definition of the manipulation of life and death concepts.

Not only can she instantly kill Paper Mario in a game over (the one I'm proposing is 11-D), but she can also bring Luvbi back during the post-game, even though such a Nimbi never existed, and was merely a persona of the Pure Heart.

So, she has the power to both instantly kill a target and, on the contrary, make it immortal.

Now, she stands no chance against Super Dimentio--according to the definition itself, in order to not be able to kill someone, they simply must have a stronger concept.

And what's a stronger concept than higher dimensionality? Merloo supports it, and Jaydes supports Merloo. Heck, the Pure Hearts support it, as they have infinite power when in comparison to normal characters. This is all very consistent--and, it provides great reasoning for why the Chaos Heart and Pure Hearts were needed. Everything just... adds up.

The tricky thing is that both are 12-D at their peak. One of Mario's major advantages here is that he has Time Paradoxal Resistance, as he is unaffected by the Void erasing the past, just in his base form. The Pure Hearts give him an infinite boost in power and durability. Unfortunately, a lot of Mario's and Sonic's hax would be ineffective on each other, as a lot of them include Space-Time Manipulation and other lesser things which both have already dealt with. Mario, however, has a few things which give him a slight edge. The Showstopper, might be able to just OHKO Super Sonic, as they are exactly the same level of power and durability. Mario has also learned a few techniques from the Star Spirits which could give him a MASSIVE advantage. Mario could lower Sonic's power with Chill Out or put him to sleep with Lullaby. However, I'm not sure if Mario can use these without the Star Spirits. Still, Mario has a few other things he can use on his own. Power Lift increases the power and defense of Mario and his team temporarily, and Mario could use Art Attack to Reality Warp and pierce Sonic's defenses. One of Mario's biggest advantages is that with the Pure Hearts, he can literally reset all of reality, while Sonic can only warp it. Another thing is that God Sigma is barely 12-D, while Super Dimentio is 12-D AND has Invulnerability, and Mario killed him. You would have to be far superior to an invincible being in order to kill them. Not saying Pure Hearts Mario is 13-D, but he should be on a higher level of 12-D than Sonic is. It's a close match, but Mario has a slight edge due to hax and defeating an invincible 12-D being w/the Pure Hearts.

1. Mario - Because of the above, I'd say Mario wins this round.

However, this is just my opinion. If you disagree, that's fine with me.